Kaddish - different Nuscho'os
- BAvis
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02 Aug 2009 02:55 #1166
by BAvis
Kaddish - different Nuscho'os was created by BAvis
Although it would certainly not be Nusach Ashkenaz, has there ever been found a single manuscript or printing from any nusach/עדה , prior to the printed Siddur of Rabbi Shlomo Zalman Hanau in 1725, that contains anything other than Yisgadal V'Yiskadash (with a פת"ח under each respective דל"ת)?
I'm aware that in regard to some of the Vilna Gaon's customs there is doubt or dispute as to how he conducted himself. For example, the issue of the word Zeicher vs. Zecher, in parshas Zochor, as Rabbi Hamburger Shlit"a pointed out in his recent lecture on the subject of imbalance in contemporary halachic observance.
Is there any dispute or question about the מעשה רב's statement in chapter 54 where he writes: נוסח הקדיש יתגדל ויתקדש שני דלתין בצירי, כדעת רש"י בלקוטי פרדס שהוא בלשון עברי or is this the uncontested custom of the Vilna Gaon?
BAvis
I'm aware that in regard to some of the Vilna Gaon's customs there is doubt or dispute as to how he conducted himself. For example, the issue of the word Zeicher vs. Zecher, in parshas Zochor, as Rabbi Hamburger Shlit"a pointed out in his recent lecture on the subject of imbalance in contemporary halachic observance.
Is there any dispute or question about the מעשה רב's statement in chapter 54 where he writes: נוסח הקדיש יתגדל ויתקדש שני דלתין בצירי, כדעת רש"י בלקוטי פרדס שהוא בלשון עברי or is this the uncontested custom of the Vilna Gaon?
BAvis
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- Michael
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09 Aug 2009 02:27 #1232
by Michael
Replied by Michael on topic Kaddish - different Nuscho'os
Yisgadeil Veyiskadeish is not known before R' Zalman Henne. The Gr'o accepted it and so did the Pri Megodim.
The Gr'o is in Ma'aseh Rav siman נד, mentioning that according to Rashi that it is supposed to be in Hebrew.
Michael FRBSH
The Gr'o is in Ma'aseh Rav siman נד, mentioning that according to Rashi that it is supposed to be in Hebrew.
Michael FRBSH
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- rallisw
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16 Nov 2009 03:40 #1499
by rallisw
Minhag Avoseinu Torah Hee!
Replied by rallisw on topic Kaddish - different Nuscho'os
Kaddish: "Yisborach, v'yistabach v'yispo-ar" "Yisboraych, v'yishtabach v'yispoayr"
Kaddish Tisqabal:
Is the phrase; "Tisqabayl tzl'ous-houn uvus-houn di chol bays Yisroel" or "Tisqabal tzl'ous-houn uvus-houn d' chol Yisroel"
Aseres Y'may Tshuvoh: "Ouseh Sholoum" Ouseh HaSholoum"
Kaddish Yosoum:
"v'chayim oleinu" "v'chayim (touvim) oleinu"
"Hu ya-aseh sholoum" "Hu (b'rachamov) ya-aseh sholoum"
Are these changes made by 'Nusach Sfard' (Chassidim)?
Rallis
Kaddish Tisqabal:
Is the phrase; "Tisqabayl tzl'ous-houn uvus-houn di chol bays Yisroel" or "Tisqabal tzl'ous-houn uvus-houn d' chol Yisroel"
Aseres Y'may Tshuvoh: "Ouseh Sholoum" Ouseh HaSholoum"
Kaddish Yosoum:
"v'chayim oleinu" "v'chayim (touvim) oleinu"
"Hu ya-aseh sholoum" "Hu (b'rachamov) ya-aseh sholoum"
Are these changes made by 'Nusach Sfard' (Chassidim)?
Rallis
Minhag Avoseinu Torah Hee!
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- Michael
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11 Dec 2009 17:30 #1539
by Michael
Replied by Michael on topic Kaddish - different Nuscho'os
In all cases the second option was either wrong or Sephardic, except for Tiskabal, in that case the second option is the correct one.
Oseh Hasholom was done by those who stoped saying Boruch Ato Hashem Oseh Hasholom at the end of Shemoneh Esreh (during עשרת ימי תשובה), so instead they said Oseh Hasholom at the end of Kaddish.
Michael FRBSH
Oseh Hasholom was done by those who stoped saying Boruch Ato Hashem Oseh Hasholom at the end of Shemoneh Esreh (during עשרת ימי תשובה), so instead they said Oseh Hasholom at the end of Kaddish.
Michael FRBSH
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